Season 6 · Episode 8
Society columnist · Vogue editor · novelist
Released 7 Oct 2026 · 1:01:07 as a podcast
Every name, club, book, song, night and look from the interview - 166 references and 456 mentions in this episode. After five seasons downtown, James takes the show uptown with Billy Norwich, the Daily News society columnist of the go-go 80s. Billy explains how the paper's twin columns began - Uptown for him, Downtown for Dinah Prince - and traces the line from the Cholly Knickerbockers to Suzy, his 'spirit animal'. Then Brooke Astor, queen bee of the new and old money, Jayne Wrightsman's last interview at the Met, Blaine Trump's Lacroix benefit and the society women who raised money for AIDS when, as Billy says, the government gave nothing. James remembers being escorted out of an East Hampton party in a little-girl outfit, and Billy tells how Anna Wintour cheered him up when his phone stopped ringing during the newspaper strike. Wow!
Shaved head, white beard, round tortoiseshell glasses and a black roll-neck under a black wrap
A white bedroom with a bed, pillows in green and lilac, a ladder and stacked shopping bags and boxes
Ponytails and a pinafore
The look that got James escorted out in East Hampton, as he tells it
Where Billy arrived 'just off the bus'; he says New York reinvents its social hierarchy every ten years or so
The queen bee of uptown society. James remembers her in her 80s with her wig a little askew and millions in emeralds; Billy says she called herself the 'nouveau poor' and welcomed the new money, and never asked him to call her Brooke
FashionWig askew, emeralds (see Mood)
Heard as “Astor / Brooke / Mrs. Astor / brooke”
The society columnist known as Suzy - Billy's 'spirit animal'. Her move from the Daily News to the New York Post left the hole his column filled; Billy says she later went to Women's Wear Daily. James dreams of editing a book of her columns
Heard as “Amy Mailey / Mailey / Maley / Maly”
Old-money philanthropist married to Robert Trump. Billy says she organised Christian Lacroix's first show as a Memorial Sloan Kettering benefit, brought him to God's Love We Deliver, and came with him to see Lypsinka and Joey Arias. James remembers her visiting Disco 2000 with Marc Jacobs. Billy still talks to her
Heard as “Blaine”
Billy remembers him in the 80s as a P.T. Barnum showman - 'New York's clown'. He says he never knew people's politics then; he says many New Yorkers who worked for him had to settle for half their pay, and that people close to him like Ivana knew his tempers. James remembers liking him for opening his doors to downtown
Heard as “Donald / Trump / Trumps”
The guest: journalist, novelist and editor (Vogue, The New York Times, New York Magazine), and in the 80s the Daily News uptown society columnist - first 'Uptown' opposite Dinah Prince's 'Downtown', then a column under his own name. Links to his Night Fever episode
FashionUptown dinner jacket by Dianne Brill (see Mood)
Heard as “Billy / William / William Norch / William Norwich”
Billy's paper: the Uptown column, then his own column, for six years
Heard as “Daily News / daily news”
Wrote the Downtown half of the Daily News column while Billy wrote Uptown; Billy says she left for a better job at New York Magazine, where she wanted to write long form
Heard as “Dina / Dinah / Dinah Prince”
James says Vanity Fair called her the only person who intimidated Brooke Astor. Billy found her publicity-shy, beguiling and very funny; he did her last interview, for Vogue, at the Met's Dangerous Liaisons show in the Wrightsman galleries
Heard as “Jane Reisman / Jane Reitzman / Mrs. Reisman / Mrs. Reitzman”
Billy was an editor there while still writing his column, over lunch with the door closed
Heard as “Vogue / vogue”
Host; first met Billy at the Fellini premiere at Trump Tower and keeps diaries he checked for this episode
FashionA 'junior league garden party look' in yellow for Billy (see Mood)
Heard as “James”
Gossip columnist Billy met through Holland Taylor; he says she told the Daily News to hire 'a boy, a young one' - him. Billy says she and Suzy loathed each other (they made up before Liz died) and that she kept Suzygate going in her own column
Heard as “Liz / Liz Smith”
Fashion and society columnist Billy assisted while studying at Columbia, helping her get her 1,200 words a day out - his start in journalism
Heard as “Eugenia Shepard / Ms. Shepard / Ms. Shepherd”
Billy is proudest of chronicling society women's AIDS fundraising when, as he says, the government gave nothing
Heard as “AIDS”
The Daily News's twin society columns: Dinah Prince downtown on Mondays and Wednesdays, Billy uptown on Tuesdays and Thursdays
Heard as “Uptown, Downtown / uptown Downtown / uptown, downtown”
Billy names her among the society women who threw their weight behind AIDS work and says she got through to Nancy Reagan
Heard as “Judy / Judy P. Bode / Peabody”
Billy's first night at a New York disco: as he tells it, Capote was there with Kate Harrington and wiped out on the dance floor
Heard as “Capodium / Capote”
The Egg Lady from Pink Flamingos - 'more eggs!' - who Billy saw alongside Divine
Heard as “Egg lady / egg lady / more eggs”
Lured Suzy away with a ton of money, Billy says; later hired Billy for two years
Heard as “New York Post / the Post”
John Fairchild's paper; it called the new money 'Nouvelle Society'
Heard as “Woman's Wear Daily / Womansware / Womanswear Daily / Women's Wear”
John Fairchild's number two at Women's Wear Daily and W; called Billy about WWD's column the day he got the Daily News job, and later teased him during the newspaper strike
Heard as “Patrick / Patrick McCarthy”
Billy's office at Vogue was across from hers. During the newspaper strike, as he tells it, she told him not to worry - she could always get him a job at Brides. He says she has the driest sense of humour
Heard as “Anna / Anna Winter / Wintour / Yana”
Billy worked there between two stints at Vogue
Heard as “New York Times”
The society-column pen name used in turn by Maury Paul and Igor Cassini, as Billy traces the line of New York society columnists
Heard as “Charlie Knickerbocker”
The actress Billy calls 'the sister of my invention' and his best friend; she introduced him to Liz Smith
Heard as “Holland / Holland Taylor”
Liz Smith said Billy could get her phone number from her grandson. Billy says Mrs. Vreeland called him when he got the column to give her advice: everyone has a story, but the real story takes time to learn
Heard as “Freeland / Rieland / Vreeland”
Named by James among the new-money hostesses of the Reagan years
Heard as “Gayfred / Gayfried Steinberg / Steinberg / Steinbergs”
Like Mrs. Astor, Billy says, she never said 'call me Jackie'
Heard as “jackie / onassis / onassus”
Blaine Trump's husband - 'not like his brother', Billy says
Heard as “Robert / Robert Trump”
Billy says Blaine Trump organised his first show in New York as a fundraiser for Memorial Sloan Kettering
FashionFlamboyant 80s couture (see Mood)
Heard as “Christian look / Lacroix / lacroix”
Ganga Stone's meals charity; Billy went with Blaine Trump and wrote about it; a radio telethon put it on the map, he says
Heard as “God's love / God's love, we deliver / God's lovely”
Billy says she loathed her party's early attitude to AIDS and that her best friends were gay men
Heard as “Mrs. Reagan / Nancy Reagan / Rancy Reagan”
James remembers her at the Trump Tower premiere and that they loved her
Heard as “Ivana”
Co-host; asks whether the column's 'keep it under the table' advice changed how Billy lived
Heard as “Barbado / Randy”
Where Dinah Prince went; Billy says an enemy fed items about him to its Intelligencer
Where Billy grew up - 'I only knew nice people in Connecticut'
Named by James among the new-money hostesses of the Reagan years
Heard as “Good Friends / Goodfriend / Susan Goodfriend”
The Met's exhibition staged in the Wrightsman galleries, where Billy interviewed Jayne Wrightsman for Vogue
Heard as “Costume Institute / dangerous liaison / liaison d'Anchereuse”
How Billy describes Donald Trump's 80s showmanship
Heard as “P. T. Barnum / P.T. Barnum”
Billy's date at the Trump Tower premiere, as James remembers it (name as heard)
Heard as “Huntington Murdoch / Pamela Huntington / Pamela Murdoch”
With James at the Hamptons party and at Régine's for Gaultier
Heard as “Musto”
Billy took Blaine Trump to see him; Joey was one of Billy's first bosses in New York, managing Fiorucci when Billy sold books and postcards there
Heard as “Joe Ayer / Joey”
The paper didn't publish for a couple of days; Billy's phone stopped ringing - the lesson that made him keep journalists as his friends
Heard as “on strike / strike”
Co-host; asks where Donald Trump fitted into 80s uptown society
Heard as “Fenton”
Made Billy's 'Uptown' dinner jacket; also at the Hamptons party James was thrown out of
FashionBilly's dinner jacket (see Mood)
Heard as “Diane Brill”
When the hustle came in, Billy took lessons at Roseland
Heard as “hustle lessons / the hustle”
Number five on Billy's numbered list of clubs
Founder of the Best-Dressed List, as the hosts and Billy sort out who started what
Heard as “Eleanor Lambert / Eleanor Randall”
Eugenia Sheppard's friend who covered the New Look in Paris with her after the war and turned Women's Wear Daily into gossipy coverage of the industry
The how-to-be-a-journalist book Anthea Disney gave Billy
Heard as “Headlines and Deadlines / headlines and deadlines”
Named among the stars who keep their mystique; Fenton notes she has just done a book
Heard as “Tilda”
Blaine Trump's first big cause; Lacroix's first show raised money for it
Heard as “Sloan Kettering / sloan kettering”
Christian Lacroix's first fashion show, organised by Blaine Trump as a fundraiser, around 86-87 as Billy remembers
Heard as “first fashion show / lacroix party”
Billy: these Republican women threw their weight behind AIDS work
Heard as “Republican”
A street fair for AIDS research started by Bill Blass and Glenn Bernbaum
Heard as “Feta de Family / Fete of the Family”
Glenn Bernbaum's restaurant - 'the Studio 54 of the 80s', Billy says
Heard as “Mortimer”
Where James first met Billy, at the Fellini premiere
The pink carpet from MoMA ran down Fifth Avenue to Trump Tower; Billy says downtown is now the new Fifth Avenue
Where James was escorted out of a party Billy brought them to
Heard as “Hamptons”
Billy brought James, Dianne Brill, Michael Musto and Anita Sarko to a very chic East Hampton party; James says he was escorted out in his little-girl outfit and Billy wrote that he couldn't help 'a celebutante being escorted from a party'
FashionLittle-girl outfit with ponytails and a pinafore (see Mood)
Heard as “escorted from a party / escorted me out”
The look that got James escorted out in East Hampton, as he tells it
FashionPonytails and a pinafore
Heard as “pinafore / ponytails”
His party at Régine's, where Billy took James upstairs to the uptown crowd
Heard as “Gaultier / Gautier”
Billy took James upstairs to the uptown party; James says Billy then vanished 'like Homer Simpson into the hedge'
Heard as “Gaultier party / Regines for Gautier”
Billy sold books and postcards there when Joey Arias managed the store
Its strike stopped the Daily News for a few days; Billy and Liz Smith weren't members
Heard as “Newspaper Guild / the guild”
Newsday columnist and Revlon heir who, Billy says, exposed that Suzy wasn't doing her own reporting
Heard as “Revson”
James asks Billy about it; Billy says James Revson exposed it and Liz Smith kept it going. James recalls Michelangelo Signorile broke it
Heard as “Susie Gate”
Still writes her column every day, Billy says
Heard as “Cindy Adams / Cindy Allen Adams”
Long Island paper whose New York City edition hired James Revson
Heard as “New York Newsday / Newsday”
The hosts' company
James's on-camera outfit is 'a junior league garden party look' in Billy's honour
Billy edited there, James says in the intro
Billy's novel
The jacket made for Billy's 'Uptown' column persona, as he tells it
FashionDinner jacket by Dianne Brill
Heard as “dinner jacket”
The uptown-downtown line - people said they got a nosebleed above it
Billy's first New York disco, just off the bus - Truman Capote was there
With Truman Capote at New York, New York, as Billy remembers
Billy's second club: 'exquisite' - in summer they opened the garage door
Where Billy took hustle lessons when the hustle came in
Heard as “Roseland”
Women and men alike in his dresses and high heels at the townhouse club Billy remembers
FashionStephen Burrows dresses (see Mood)
Heard as “Stephen Burroughs”
Billy's 'bisexual heaven': a townhouse with dancing on every floor, women and men in Stephen Burrows dresses and heels; the hosts had never heard of it (name as heard)
FashionStephen Burrows dresses and heels (see Mood)
Heard as “Flamingo Ace”
The townhouse club Billy remembers: dresses and high heels on the women as well
FashionStephen Burrows dresses, high heels
Heard as “Burroughs dresses”
On Billy's list
Heard as “area”
On Billy's list
Heard as “mud club”
The first Cholly Knickerbocker, as Billy tells it
Oleg Cassini's brother and a later Cholly Knickerbocker
Billy's Daily News feature was 'sort of a precursor to Spy', he says
Heard as “spy magazine”
Billy's freelance Daily News piece on how to be a social climber in New York, laid out as a Monopoly board
Heard as “Touch of Crass”
Where Eugenia Sheppard and John Fairchild covered the New Look
Billy's Sunday column
Heard as “Social Circus”
The British editor who hired Billy at the Daily News and gave him a book called Headlines and Deadlines - plus some blunt advice about keeping his private life private, as he tells it
Anthea Disney went on to do great things there
Billy's column voice was 'Damon Runyonesque', he says
Heard as “Damon Runyonesque”
Billy says it wrote about authors' enemies leaving bad Amazon reviews
Heard as “London Times”
Brooke Astor's husband; James says he left her money to spread around New York
James's memory: wig a little askew, an eyelash on her eyebrow - and millions in emeralds
FashionEmeralds, wig, lipstick
Heard as “emeralds”
Everyone's decorator in the old world; Billy tells her wicker joke about the new money
Heard as “Sister Parrish”
James remembers its article on Brooke Astor and Jane Wrightsman
Named by Billy among the photographers who made society ladies' legends in Vogue
Named by Billy among the Vogue photographers of society ladies
Heard as “Horace”
Named by Billy among the Vogue photographers of society ladies
Heard as “Avigan”
Photographed Jayne Wrightsman for a Vogue philanthropy story, as Billy remembers it
Heard as “Leibowitz”
Home of the Costume Institute and the Wrightsman galleries
Heard as “the Met”
Billy doubts she could answer a question as wittily as Mrs. Wrightsman
Heard as “Kardashian”
Billy: you can photograph her at a party, but you can't go and talk to her
Named among the stars who keep their mystique (heard as 'Kate Manchad')
Heard as “Kate Manchad”
Blaine Trump grew up in Europe and Japan
Blaine Trump grew up in Europe and Japan
Billy: the clothes matched the flamboyance of the new money - so you had Lacroix
FashionLacroix poufs and big 80s ball gowns
Heard as “flamboyance”
Founder of God's Love We Deliver; Billy says she wrote to Blaine Trump
Named by Billy among the society women behind AIDS research
Blaine Trump's first big fundraiser for God's Love: a pop-radio marathon, Billy says through Donald's connections
Heard as “telethon”
Billy says he started the Fête de Famille AIDS street fair with Glenn Bernbaum
Owner of Mortimer's, which Billy calls the Studio 54 of the 80s; co-founded the Fête de Famille
Heard as “Glenn Birnbaum”
Told Billy he was at his most vibrant when he wrote the column
Heard as “Fruserberg”
James calls her a princess of uptown society. As Billy tells it, she told her husband she wouldn't sleep with him any more unless he took back his AIDS remark
Pat Buckley's husband, the conservative writer; Billy recalls his remark about tattooing people with AIDS
Heard as “Buckley”
How, Billy says, people close to Donald Trump saw him
Raised by James among the 80s money men; Billy places him on the West Coast
Heard as “Milken”
James first met Billy at the Fellini premiere at Trump Tower
Heard as “Fellini”
A pink carpet down Fifth Avenue from MoMA to Trump Tower; uptown and downtown both invited - where James first met Billy
Heard as “premiere of Fellini”
The Fellini premiere's pink carpet started there
Heard as “Mu Museum of Modern Art”
Took Blaine Trump to a dinner party at Disco 2000, as James tells it
Heard as “Mark Jacobs”
Where Marc Jacobs brought Blaine Trump to a dinner party, as James tells it
Marc Jacobs took Blaine to a Disco 2000 dinner party around Halloween; James, in a silver space suit, told her why he couldn't see
Heard as “dinner party”
Blaine Trump's tour of the club kids' Halloween looks at Disco 2000, as James tells it
FashionPrincess and cowboy costumes
Heard as “little princess”
At Disco 2000 when Blaine Trump visited, as James tells it
FashionSilver space suit, stacked false eyelashes
Heard as “space suit”
James remembers being at a 'Heddy Heinman's' in the Hamptons before Billy took them on to the party (name as heard)
Heard as “Heddy”
With James at the Hamptons party
James, Dianne Brill, Michael Musto and Anita Sarko at the chic East Hampton party
FashionDowntown club looks
Heard as “downtown finery”
Gaultier's party, where Billy brought James upstairs to the uptown crowd
Heard as “Regines”
James's Homer-into-the-hedge meme for Billy vanishing at Régine's
Heard as “Homer Simpson”
Now 'a bargain, relatively speaking', Billy says
Billy wrote weekly for it after his columns
Where Blaine Trump mostly lives now, Billy says
Where Anna Wintour joked she could always get Billy a job, as he tells it (heard as 'Brooklyn... rides')
Heard as “Brooklyn. rides”
James recalls he broke the Suzygate story
Heard as “Signorelli”
James Revson was a Revlon heir
A white bedroom with a bed, pillows in green and lilac, a ladder and stacked shopping bags and boxes
FashionShaved head, white beard, round tortoiseshell glasses and a black roll-neck under a black wrap
His home library of packed bookshelves, a toy robot and a vintage microphone
FashionA fluffy pale-yellow fringed tweed jacket with a white collar and an owl brooch, grey-blue mottled glasses - his 'junior league garden party look'
His room with 70s sunflower wallpaper, dark striped curtains, caps on hooks and a tote bag
FashionGrey V-neck jumper over a navy-and-white striped scarf, rimless glasses; bald
A pale office with a Holy Terror poster and shelves of photos and binders
FashionBlack baseball cap, thick black round glasses and a navy roll-neck
The big number counts mentions in this episode. The gold number counts the same name across all episodes on the site. Timestamps mark the first mention. Spot something wrong? Tell me! Dive into the Network →